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SALT LAKE CITY — Tucker Carlson and Glenn Beck framed the current moment in American politics as a spiritual battle between good and evil during the fourth stop of the "Tucker Carlson live tour" in Salt Lake City on Saturday.
The two conservative talk show hosts — who each at one time boasted the status as mostwatched person on cable television — only mentioned political parties once. But references to "God," "scriptures" and "end times" filled Carlson's 30-minute opening monologue, and his and Beck's subsequent hourlong discussion, which included a prayer from Beck, before an audience of several thousand at the Delta Center.
In a conversation that ranged from lighthearted to confessional, Carlson and Beck condemned elected officials who advocate for transgender treatment for minors, support intervention in prolonged foreign conflicts and encourage the censorship of free speech, saying such leaders are not just of the wrong opinion, they are "working for evil."
"That's much deeper than political," Carlson said. "That's a theological difference."
Carlson visited Utah as part of his first live tour, which began in Arizona on Wednesday and which will criss-cross the country over the course of 16 shows, featuring guests like Republican Ohio Sen. JD Vance, former GOP presidential candidate Vivek Ramaswamy and former Democratic congresswoman Tulsi Gabbard.
Carlson has nearly 14 million followers on X, where he publishes long-form interviews with guests who he calls "the most interesting people in the world." His podcast currently ranks No. 2 on iTunes' top charts.
Recent interviewees include country musician Jason Aldean, former independent presidential candidate Robert F. Kennedy Jr., and podcaster Darryl Cooper — who received backlash online this week after calling Winston Churchill "the chief villain of the Second World War" on Carlson's Tuesday show.
Carlson defines good and evil
Carlson made a point of criticizing social media vitriol Saturday night, saying the motivation behind his live tour was to come into contact with more "normal" everyday Americans, who he said are much less divided than the media portrays them to be.
"If you experience the country through your iPhone primarily, oh, it's so dispiriting," Carlson said.
The forces that stoke division, whether they be digital, political or corporate, present one of the clearest signs of evil, according to Carlson, who listed several "nonpolitical" "markers for good and evil." Seeding confusion? Evil. Imposing chaos on order? Evil. Encouraging unity? Good.
"So if you find a leadership class that encourages the people it leads to hate each other — along racial lines, or religious lines, or lines of sex — you're looking at an act of evil. Period. And you're certainly seeing that in this country," Carlson said.
Carlson and Beck did not express hope in politicians to turn things around. Beck, a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, said after personal studies with biblical scholars, he felt like the world was in the "end times." But Beck, and Carlson, who said he is an Episcopalian, both expressed hope in the individual goodness of people.
"There is more good than there is evil," Beck said, raising his voice and rising from his chair. "But we are not standing up. Stand up and say it out loud, 'That's wrong. That's evil. That will not happen around me on my watch. Period.'"
Beck and Carlson talk Utah politicians
While Carlson praised Utahns for their kindness and pioneer ancestry, Beck took a few shots at Beehive State politicians. Beck, who mentioned he lives in Idaho with his studio in Texas, said there are "not a lot" of officials in "state government" that, as Carlson put it, "understand the stakes of what's going on."
Beck then recounted seeing several event attendees saying, "No Cox, no Cox, no Cox," referring to Utah's Republican governor, Spencer Cox. "And I completely understood it, because I'm aware of politics here," Beck said. There were dozens of volunteers at the event promoting the write-in gubernatorial candidacy of state Rep. Phil Lyman, R-Blanding, who lost in the GOP primary to Cox by 37,500 votes in June.
Lyman attended the event, as did state Reps. Trevor Lee, R-Layton, and Jefferson Burton, R-Salem, and Riverton Mayor Trent Staggs.
Lyman's running mate, Natalie Clawson, told the Deseret News they saw the event as a prime opportunity to advertise their bid for governor because they were among "friends."
"We really resonate with Tucker Carlson and Glenn Beck because of the message that they are sharing, and they stand for free speech, and they're standing against corruption," Clawson said.
Clawson said she hoped the two famous conservative personalities would bring up Utah's gubernatorial race. Carlson devoted an entire 11-minute monologue to criticizing Cox in 2022 and did so again during an interview at the Republican National Convention in July.
"He's concerned about how Utah is becoming more of a blue state under Governor Cox's leadership," Clawson said of Carlson. "We share that same concern with many of the people who are here tonight."
Carlson and Beck pointed to Utah's senior senator as an example of the representation they hoped to see more of. Carlson praised Utah Sen. Mike Lee as a friend and a "wonderful, wonderful man."
Beck responded by saying, "Quite honestly, the way the media and some leadership in this state treat Mike Lee is an abomination. He is not a radical. He is not a radical. He is a constitutionalist."
Beck: Trump assassination attempt an 'op'
Toward the conclusion of the event, Carlson asked Beck what he made of the assassination attempt against former President Donald Trump. Beck, the author of more than a dozen No. 1 bestselling books, said, "As a fiction writer, I would say that was an 'op' (government operation). They tried to kill the president of the United States."
Carlson echoed Beck's conclusion, saying the fact there was an unguarded roof within a few hundred yards of the stage where Trump stood was "conclusive" proof that "the Biden administration allowed that to happen. Period. They literally allowed it to happen. Whether knowingly or not, they allowed it to happen."
In the final minutes of his interview, Beck compared Trump to Martin Luther King Jr., as an imperfect individual who agreed to lead a movement. "The Lord will use any person, any flaws, anybody, if you just will say 'yes,'" Beck said. "Donald Trump is just the first person who said, 'OK, I'll do it.' And he will do it."
